So What was Jesus doing up in hell anyways?

[ChristVader]

See next post below.

[ChristVader]

I am not running rabbitt trails John. How can we persue a resolution ot a Scriptural delima if terms and boundries are not established?

I have had too many discussions with you where this exact thing has happened.

Eternal is dealing with it too, as he has even made the statement in so many words, ..."so you dissagree with the Creeds on this point?". Why would he ask that question John? Because he has had prior experiences just like mine where you have changed positions to avoid dealing with this issue or that issue. So yes it is relevant.

Eternal or myself have never had to ask HipHopHead something like this. Nor Smurf, Nor King Neb. Why is that John?

Now, lets get back to Scripture. When Peter says DOWN does he mean DOWN?

Kent

[ChristVader]

Never mind on the Peter reference...see below from Youngs Literal; this is "prison" is not that "hell" we all talk about today. Check the context, Peter has some major metaphores going on here...

1Peter 3:18--

18because also Christ once for sin did suffer -- righteous for unrighteous -- that he might lead us to God, having been put to death indeed, in the flesh, and having been made alive in the spirit,

19in which also to the spirits in prison having gone he did preach,

20who sometime disbelieved, when once the long-suffering of God did wait, in days of Noah -- an ark being preparing -- in which few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water;

21also to which an antitype doth now save us -- baptism, (not a putting away of the filth of flesh, but the question of a good conscience in regard to God,) through the rising again of Jesus Christ,

22who is at the right hand of God, having gone on to heaven -- messengers, and authorities, and powers, having been subjected to him.

We must go to some other Scripture's for this one.

I think the question of "what is the penalty for sin" is really the main issue here. Either Christ took it ALL upon Himself for us, or He didn't.

Beyond that I am listening to Scriptural arguments alone.

Kent

[eternal]

Kent, it seems like you are looking for an argument. Please just allow the CONVERSATION to develop on its own, and not try and jump the gun and try to pin someone into the corner, which would pressumably kill the discussion before any fruit was able to bear.

I know people who do that, and I typicaly feel they do this because they do not want to see the convo flourish, but rather see it more advantageous to kill the thread early in a shroud of scandal. I don't know if these are your intentions or not, but I do know that many will see this and think that.

Please be more hospitable when in the thread.

[ChristVader]

Eternal,

Thanks Eternal. Will do.

Kent

[DoGMaTiX]

eternal said:

Kent, it seems like you are looking for an argument. Please just allow the CONVERSATION to develop on its own, and not try and jump the gun and try to pin someone into the corner, which would pressumably kill the discussion before any fruit was able to bear.

I know people who do that, and I typicaly feel they do this because they do not want to see the convo flourish, but rather see it more advantageous to kill the thread early in a shroud of scandal. I don't know if these are your intentions or not, but I do know that many will see this and think that.

Please be more hospitable when in the thread.

Thank you Eternal.

Neb, not interested

Kent, My point stands.

[ChristVader]

Roldan,

Can you cut and paste that point please?

Kent

[DoGMaTiX]

dogmatix said:

christvader said:

What is the punishment for sin Roldan?

Death and spiritual separation from the Father which was all done on the cross where He died and The Father turned His face from Christ and left Him alone, hence Christs outcry "Father why have you forsaken me"?

Kent, according to your paradigm there is no Hell anyways. You say that Heaven is NOT a place but a status and the antithesis of heaven is hell, so hell is also a status of spiritual separation from God which does NOT require a literal place called Hell, right?

How can Jesus go to a status? Again another inconsistancy in your framework.

one